under the radar

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Posts by under the radar

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  68

  Elder wants to stop by with the CO for a visit .

  by NikL in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so i got a text from an elder who i consider one of the good guys and a friend in his own way.. he asked if he could bring the co by for a visit.

  he said it would be "just a pleasant call and visit and will hopefully encourage my wife".

  he says that "he knows she is dealing with a ton of pressure".. in all my years around the organization, i never had a visit from the circuit overseer.

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  under the radar

  NikL, you hit the nail on the head. Your wife just dropped the mother of all hints that she does not want the elders to drop by but is reluctant to say so directly. She wants to hide by you, her husband and protector. I would consider it a great compliment that she trusts you to "run interference" (an American football term) for her. It would also be an honor to show her that you love her enough to protect her from those religious bullies and take the bullet, as it were. Doing so can pay big dividends for both of you, now and in the future.
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  31

  Living with Your Parents Well Into Adulthood the Norm?

  by Sorry in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i don't want to seem like a jerk.

  i know full well economic times are not the greatest.

  there's no shame in struggling and staying with your family until you're back on your feet.

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  under the radar

  There are many reasons why some choose to live at home with their parents well into adulthood. Some financial, some sentimental, some just pure laziness or a sense of entitlement. Still, it's really not anyone else's concern as long as all involved are ok with it.

  But I strenuously object to anyone choosing not to work so they can "live at home and Pioneer" if they are on any kind of public assistance. If I knew or suspected that someone was on welfare and pioneering instead of working or actively looking for work, I'd turn them in in a heartbeat. Doubly so if they were mooching off the system with some "disability" scheme. If you can knock on doors for hours at a time, you can do some kind of work.

  Welfare cheats and disability fraudsters cost all of us tons of money every year. Turn 'em in! If you know of someone pulling this crap and don't want to turn them in yourself, PM me the details and I'll start the ball rolling myself. I love it when supposedly upstanding people are exposed for the thieves and hypocrites they are.
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  36

  JW Ideal candidates for Life Insurance?

  by MNLifeAgent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i am not a jehovah's witness, although i do respect your religion entirely.

  i am 27 years old, and live in minnesota.

  i have an older cousin, who's mother (not with my uncle -separated when my cousin was a baby) had been a witness, grew up in your word, and about 12 years ago she fully converted.

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  under the radar

  Hello, MNLifeAgent, and welcome to the forum. As you may have noted, most of the posters here are either ex-JW's or folks who feel trapped within the JW's and wish they could escape without losing all their family and friends. There are a few apologists here, but they don't make much headway. It's hard to defend the indefensible clinging to a belief system based on superstition and hocus-pocus with no basis in fact or science and where unquestioning acceptance and belief is considered a good thing.

  That said, most people other than certain over-the-top religious fanatics realize that insurance has its place as a form a protection for their families. Even the JW leaders recognize this. They published an article in one of their magazines a few years back specifically stating that buying insurance was a good way to take care of one's responsibility to provide for their family in case tragedy strikes. The article said doing so was not showing any lack of faith, but merely acknowledging Solomon's observation that "time and unforeseen occurrence befall them all."

  The only way to sell to large numbers of JW's would be to partner with some JW "heavy" (to allay suspicions and make your products have a sort of "insider" appeal), offer some kind of group policy discount (to make them feel "special"), and most importantly, set up some sort of kickback to the Society. You still won't be able to use the Kingdom Hall or convention sites for anything, but individuals might arrange a get-together of invited guests to hear your spiel and word could get around that way as more and more find they like your products or services. Certain things have caught on, almost like fads, among the JW's in the past and this might too.

  Good luck.
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  15

  Daily text for 12-7-2016 Gods promises "Dynamic"?

  by NikL in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  wife read me the daily text this morning out of the blue this morning and a couple of sentences stuck out in my head.. all of jehovah’s promises are dynamic, not static, because he is constantly working toward their fulfillment.

  (isa.

  46:10; 55:11) once a person realizes this about jehovah’s word, what he reads in the bible can exert a powerful force in his life.. .

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  under the radar

  "Dynamic" is just another buzzword becoming more popular at the moment. You could substitute "ever-changeable, washy-washy, work in progress, pie-in-the-sky, etc., etc."

  sir82 has it pegged.

  It's kinda like when JW's say, "Sometimes you can't understand Bible prophecy until it's fulfilled." Think about that vacuous statement. It undermines the very purpose of prophecy. Anyone could say, "I knew that was gonna happen. Remember when I said "something vague that a could be interpreted in a thousand different ways." Just about any statement made by anyone at any time can be massaged to seem to have predicted whatever you want it to.
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  11

  Jehovah - I don't like you.

  by berrygerry in

  1. jw
  2. experiences
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  under the radar

  I find little to respect about the J-dog. Of course, since he doesn't exist anyway, it's a moot point. It's just a crying shame that a civilization as advanced as ours still clings to old superstitions and thinks it's ok to kill others who cling to slightly different superstitions. This world would be a lot better off if there were no religion at all.
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  13

  To all elders, some probing questions on assault by a member by another member.

  by FatFreek 2005 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  the title should have read, "assault by a member toward another member".

  (unfortunately, i couldn't find a way to edit the title).

  you happen to be driving by what looks to be your own empty kingdom hall and something doesn't look quite right.

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  under the radar

  When the elders "approve" someone for baptism, it is tantamount to saying that this person has sufficient knowledge of (their version of) the teachings of the Bible to commit to living by them and that this person is therefore acceptable as a member of the congregation. All other aspects of the baptismal candidate's life (living arrangements, "acceptable" employment, sexual orientation, marital status, etc.) have been delved into and determined to meet JW standards so that the candidate doesn't bring reproach on the organization Jehovah's name.

  I agree that the organization has no legal obligation to inquire into an individual's immigration status even though they certainly inquire into everything else. But if it is known that the person is willfully breaking "Caesar's laws" on an ongoing basis, ignoring that fact by accepting them for baptism and presenting them to other JW's and the world as law-abiding Christians constitutes tacit approval and endorsement of their actions.

  I say this because while the JW's claim that baptism is merely an outward sign of one's personal dedication to God and the commitment to do his will, it is actually a de facto initiation into the Watchtower Society, regardless of how they phrase it or what organizational name they use. The JW baptismal "vows" no longer offer even a pretense that the candidate is being baptized in the name of "the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit." It is much more like a swearing-in ceremony than a traditional Christian baptism.

  I believe there are two main reasons the elders are told not to consider a baptismal candidate's immigration status when deciding whether to approve them for baptism. First, most of what little growth there is in the West and particularly in the US is among Hispanics and it appears that a disproportionate number of those are "undocumented." The Society needs all the new members it can get (to boost their numbers), and can't afford to turn away whole groups of potential guileless victims converts. Second, if it became widely known that JW's were "withholding baptism" on the basis of a person's legal immigration status, it would probably generate a lot of bad publicity and the backlash could be dramatic. Certain cities or companies might refuse to rent them facilities for their precious (and moneymaking) conventions. I have no doubt that certain of the media would be positively apoplectic. It would be the height of political incorrectness. I can hear it now: "Principle be damned! We gotta protect our money reputation!"

  In at least one instance, elders were instructed in writing and on official Watchtower stationery to accept for baptism a self-confessed murderer who was even at that time a fugitive from the law. While I accept that elders are not the police and it is not their place to investigate crime and enforce Caesar's laws, it sure seems odd to me that the organization would want to be complicit in cloaking such a person with the appearance of living (their version of) a Christian life.

  Especially when they are so quick to denounce and shun an otherwise exemplary member whose only "sin" is to question any Watchtower doctrine, interpretation, or policy, however mercurial and self-serving it may be. Now that's hypocrisy on an industrial scale.
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  103

  My life ... and how JWD came to be - Part 5

  by Simon in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  my life ... and how jwd came to be - part 1. my life ... and how jwd came to be - part 2. my life ... and how jwd came to be - part 3. my life ... and how jwd came to be - part 4. i swear, i thought it was only a couple of years at most since i wrote part 4 of "my life and how jwd came to be".

  i re-read it after someone posted to it and brought it back on active topics and it was kind of prophetic in a way ... well, i had the 5 years part right if nothing else:.

  it would be nice to visit the site (or whatever one is around then) in 5 years time to let people know how we're doing and find only a few of the same people still around.

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  under the radar

  Hello Simon and Angharad!

  I'm so glad this thread was resurrected. It's been so long it felt like I reading it for the first time. You're a very good story teller, Simon, and that's good because you have very interesting story to tell.

  Did you ever find the tapes of your JC and post them? If so, I'd appreciate your telling me how to find them. If not, I completely understand that you have much more important things on your mind and may have just decided to let dead dogs lie.

  I haven't been to Calgary recently, but the next time I do it would be my pleasure to meet you and your family for a nice dinner. My treat, of course. And don't worry. I have no agenda. No requests, no favors to ask. I'd just like to meet and visit with the couple who have done so much to help others escape and recover from being victimized by the mind-control cult the Watchtower has become.

  Or if you're ever in the Boston area, let me know and I'll make every effort to meet up with y'all there.

  Thanks again for all you and Miss Angharad do.

  Radar
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  25

  My oldest friend, Quincy Roberts, Ex-JW died last night at age 66

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the first time i walked into a kingdom hall, i was about 15 years old.

  i shook hands with a 12-year-old named quincy.

  as time passed and we grew older, quincy hung out with us older j-dubs.

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  under the radar

  This entire thread is a wonderful tribute to your friend, Terry. So sorry for your loss. I agree with others here who said, "They don't make friends like you anymore."

  I too have lost friends and loved ones, and not always through death, though it seems just as painful. Many others have suffered their own personal losses. Someone far wiser than I once said that grief shared was grief divided, but love shared was love multiplied. I believe that is true. Let us share your grief and multiply the love you had for your dear friends. You are not alone.

  Take care...
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  12

  Trump in Prophecy

  by Vanderhoven7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  two weeks ago i got an email from a friend saying that according to a recent prophecy, trump would win the election by a landslide.

  as i dug into it, i found the following:.

  http://www.charismanews.com/opinion/57209-shocking-2011-prophecy-about-donald-trump-becoming-president.

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  under the radar

  Simon is absolutely right. This is BS from the get-go. The JW's do much the same thing when they try to explain away yet another prediction that proves false. I've actually heard from the platform, "Sometimes you can't understand a Bible prophecy until it is fulfilled." Well, duh! Anybody can point to some vague statement in the past than can be interpreted to fit the circumstances and say, "See! I told you so!" That approach defeats the whole purpose of "prophecy."

  Trump didn't win in any landslide anyway. He did get the required number of electoral votes to win, but not by a huge margin. And it appears that Hillary actually got more popular votes that he did. Either way, it's much more of a razor thin victory than a landslide.

  That said, he is in fact the President-elect. So we all have to just deal with it and do the best with whatever comes our way. He may surprise us. Reagan wasn't the greatest genius of all time, but (with Nancy's help) he surrounded himself with competent people and actually listened to them. I think Reagan's greatest strength (other than looking Presidential and being a gifted orator) was that he could give people an assignment and then get out of their way and let them do their jobs. I don't know if Trump can do that. We'll see...

  By the way, this is not an endorsement of Trump, Reagan, or anyone else. All Presidents have their pluses and minuses, their devoted supporters and vehement opposers. This is just what I hope is an objective observer's viewpoint. I try to be pragmatic and just deal with the facts as they are. There are times when you can't change your circumstances, so you just adapt the best you can and move on. The main thing is to never give up.
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  13

  Jehovah's Witnesses DO break up families

  by UnshackleTheChains in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this recording was the final straw for me.

  https://youtu.be/ks2ld6pjybo.

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  under the radar

  That first recording was heartbreaking! I couldn't bring myself to watch the second one.

  The elders were conducting a veritable inquisition. How did you get to the airport? What about the other day when your parents were seen at your home? What busybodies! Modern day Pharisees in action.

  I hope the young lady realizes how lucky she will be if she finally gets free of this mind-control cult and moves on with her life.